{"id":1163,"date":"2019-09-18T21:51:22","date_gmt":"2019-09-18T21:51:22","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/au\/blog\/brand-lifetime-value-customer-taylor-holiday\/"},"modified":"2025-09-28T20:42:01","modified_gmt":"2025-09-28T20:42:01","slug":"brand-lifetime-value-customer-taylor-holiday","status":"publish","type":"blog","link":"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/au\/blog\/brand-lifetime-value-customer-taylor-holiday\/","title":{"rendered":"Brand is the Lifetime Value of Your Customer [With Taylor Holiday]"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<div class=\"wp-block-shipbob-blocks-single-toc single-toc\" data-controller=\"blog-toc-controller\" data-action=\"scroll@window-&gt;blog-toc-controller#scrollChanged:passive\" id=\"toc-component\"><div class=\"single-toc-overview\"><p>Table of Contents<\/p><div class=\"single-toc-read-time\"><p>** Minutes<\/p><\/div><\/div>\n<p><a href=\"#h-recognizing-that-brand-ltv\">Recognizing that brand = LTV<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"#h-the-simple-framework-for-building-a-brand-that-lasts-starts-with-a-brand-promise\">The simple framework for building a brand that lasts starts with a brand promise<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"#h-going-from-product-to-brand\">Going from product to brand<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"#h-optimizing-facebook-vs-your-supply-chain\">Optimising Facebook vs. your supply chain<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"#h-conclusion\">Conclusion<\/a><\/p>\n<\/div>\n\n\n\n<p><em>This is part two in our interview series on the secrets to finding DTC brand success. <\/em><em>Read part one <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/dtc-brand-success-formula-web-smith\/\">here<\/a>.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-shipbob-blocks-blog-callout blog-callout\">\n<p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-medium wp-image-5431\" src=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/Taylor-Holiday-300x300-1.png?w=1280px\" alt=\"\" width=\"300\" height=\"300\" data-responsive-img srcset=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/Taylor-Holiday-300x300-1.png?w=700px 650w, https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/Taylor-Holiday-300x300-1.png?w=860px 768w, https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/Taylor-Holiday-300x300-1.png?w=1180px 1080w, https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/Taylor-Holiday-300x300-1.png?w=1400px 1280w, https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/Taylor-Holiday-300x300-1.png?w=1600px 1440w\" fetchpriority=\"low\" \/><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Taylor Holiday, Managing Partner of <a href=\"https:\/\/commonthreadco.com\/\">Common Thread Collective<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<\/div>\n\n\n\n<p>\u201cBrand marketing\u201d is often seen as hand-wavey hocus pocus, while performance marketing is the only true way to measure the ROI of marketing dollars.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>The thinking goes: <em>You can pay for brand impressions, but getting your products in front of buyers \u2014 and converting them to customers \u2014 is the only true measure of ecommerce success.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>\u201cBrand\u201d is useful for luxury products, but for the rest of the online selling universe, selling products through AdWords and Facebook is the path to profitability.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>But what if we told you that the most important ecommerce KPI also doubles as your #1 brand marketing metric? What if we said that Customer Lifetime Value (LTV) is your brand?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>We sat down with Taylor Holiday, managing partner of <a href=\"https:\/\/commonthreadco.com\/\">Common Thread Collective<\/a>, and owner of <a href=\"https:\/\/4x400.com\/\">4\u00d7400,<\/a> to get his unique take.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>We discussed, among other things:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>How direct-to-consumer companies should measure brand<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>The differences between selling a product and running a brand<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>How to identify cost savings in the right places (hint: it\u2019s not related to your marketing budget)<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-recognizing-that-brand-ltv\">Recognizing that brand = LTV<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Running a DTC ad agency, Taylor Holiday isn\u2019t only focused on what you traditionally may associate with <a href=\"https:\/\/referralrock.com\/blog\/performance-marketing\/\">performance marketing<\/a>. He views success as not just when people click your ad and become a customer, but when customers return to purchase again.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>\u201cTo me brand is very simply LTV \u2014 to be a customer for life. Brand and performance marketing are two sides of the same coin,\u201d Taylor said.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-style-blog is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>\u201cLTV is all about the ability to measure your brand\u2019s existence. If no one comes back to buy your product again, you\u2019ve either failed to deliver on the brand experience or people don\u2019t value that experience.\u201d<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Taylor Holiday, Managing Partner of Common Thread Collective<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>Even if his agency Common Thread Collective creates a great campaign, the ecommerce business won\u2019t scale if their customers don\u2019t come back.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Bill Bernbach, renowned american advertising creative director from the 1960s, made famous the concept of great advertising reveals bad product faster. Doing paid advertising for great brands is much easier and cheaper when people show up independent of your direct payment for them, as you\u2019re great at giving them the experience they want.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Once you\u2019ve convinced people to try the product, will it meet their expectations? The real measurement is <a href=\"https:\/\/exponea.com\/blog\/customer-lifetime-value-guide\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">customer loyalty<\/a>. Once you release your next set of products, will those customers that you\u2019ve acquired come back and buy again?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Can awesome products have terrible brands? Yes. Can terrible products have customers for life? Yes. Think about cable companies with recurring billing models that have terrible customer service, very little brand affinity, and virtually no competitors.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Of course, the best brands are the ones that stand out in a competitive space, because they\u2019ve had to create a distinctive set of attributes to have a relationship with the customer.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-the-simple-framework-for-building-a-brand-that-lasts-starts-with-a-brand-promise\">The simple framework for building a brand that lasts starts with a brand promise<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Many companies will be in existence for two years before they ask, \u201cHow do we become a brand?\u201d Or, in other words, \u201cHow do we get people to buy more than one product from us?\u201d Ideally, this should be figured out before you launch.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Taylor has a simple \u2014 but brilliant \u2014 framework for building brands:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>Identify a presumed brand promise.<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Make a hypothesis about which products deliver on that promise.<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Once you get data, <strong>the branding experience is the product that best delivers on the brand promise \u2014&nbsp;which also satisfies \u201cperformance marketing\u201d goals.<\/strong><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n\n\n<p>For example, his skincare brand <a href=\"https:\/\/bambuearth.com\/\">Bambu Earth<\/a> was launched on the premise that the core product would make customers feel great about themselves, which would then manifest itself in repeat purchases.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>They assumed people would buy the flagship product again. But when the brand promise was delivered, they went back and ordered different products. This taught Taylor and team that the brand was really about trust to solve a set of related problems, not just one.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>The customer journey was predicated on trust with the brand, not feeling good about one product. They were wrong, and adjusted accordingly.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-why-you-need-to-start-with-a-hypothesis\">Why you need to start with a hypothesis<\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p>Taylor recalled a meeting for a major retailer with a collection of buyers, who were really smart, world-class design and brand professionals discussing a product concept they\u2019re in the process of raising money for.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>\u201cThey had a 60-page incredibly beautiful deck that walks through the mission of the company, their market position, the value proposition, and what their products are going to look like visually \u2014 a \u201cbrand\u201d deck,\u201d he said. \u201cBut what was fundamentally missing is the answer to what the actual customer experience is.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>What is the first product a customer is going to order? What is the margin on that order? What is the<a href=\"https:\/\/www.daasity.com\/post\/repurchase-rate\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\"> repurchase rate<\/a>? How successful are you going to be at getting them to repurchase? How many times are they going to purchase within nine months? And where is the cash flow you need to support that?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>This top-notch team couldn\u2019t answer these questions. They did not have a proper customer acquisition model thought out, including the overall ROI and specific KPIs.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>\u201cIt\u2019s so critically important to understand what your customer acquisition costs will be and how much you\u2019re willing to spend. If an advertising partner tells you, \u2018I will create the ad that will work for you, they\u2019re selling snake oil,\u2019\u201d said Taylor. \u201cRather than try to guess about being right, we\u2019ve learned how to learn really fast. You want to have hypotheses formed on the best available information.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-ltv-gt-click-through-rate-ctr\">LTV &gt; click through rate (CTR)<\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p>If you give an advertiser the objective of generating the highest CTR possible, you\u2019re basically giving them the license to say anything, independent of whether it\u2019s consistent with the brand.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>It\u2019s not just about high CTR, but having a compelling ad that\u2019s accurate. A product that can\u2019t deliver will lead to a low <a href=\"https:\/\/www.daasity.com\/post\/customer-lifetime-value\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">customer LTV<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-style-blog is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>\u201cDon\u2019t worry about trying to create branding. The most success comes when there\u2019s congruence in the entire customer journey. Meaning the promise you made in an ad is consistent with the promise they see on the website, which is consistent with the experience that they have when they actually interact with the product.\u201d<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Taylor Holiday, Managing Partner of Common Thread Collective<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>The strongest repeat purchase rate \u2014 and when you see the highest LTV \u2014 is when there\u2019s consistency all the way through. To find this, you have to analyse all of your products, all consumption rates, and repeat purchase rate by SKU. Which product gets replenished the most? Which are customers not interacting with? It\u2019s a never-ending process.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Good brands will find behaviour showing that when a customer tried one product and the brand promise was delivered on, they ordered that product again. Then, they continue using those same attention-grabbing tactics with different SKUs they launch.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-going-from-product-to-brand\">Going from product to brand<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>One of Taylor\u2019s brands, <a href=\"https:\/\/fcgoods.com\/\">FC Goods<\/a>, which repurposes forgotten baseball gloves into one-of-a-kind leather products, has historically been a one-product company. \u201cWhat\u2019s going to determine if we\u2019re a product or a brand, is when we release a belt, a watch, or other products made from other materials,\u201d Taylor said.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>If customers buy them, it proves that they actually live up to their reputation and can develop customer relationships over a long time. But if they can\u2019t invite customers further into the brand story, they just created a campaign for a single product.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>FC Goods has experienced substantial growth, growing to near $3 million in revenue from only single purchases. But according to Taylor, that doesn\u2019t prove they\u2019re a brand yet. \u201cWe have dollars to work with to acquire customers, but we will not be able to scale the brand that way,\u201d he said.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>And Facebook ads are a different game now. \u201dIt\u2019s not that the game is harder,\u201d Taylor explained. \u201cEveryone thinks, \u2018Facebook\u2019s not working anymore,\u2019 but it still has all the power of volume and distribution that it always had, but now the rules are different.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>He explained that you have to understand which customers relate to which messages and the cost-per-acquisition (CPA) for each of them. (Check out Taylor\u2019s Black Friday marketing guide to profitability <a href=\"https:\/\/commonthreadco.com\/blogs\/coachs-corner\/holiday-marketing-ecommerce-strategy\">here<\/a>.)<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Growth marketers from companies like Nike have sophisticated systems where if you initially bought on full price, you will never see a discount. And if you bought on discount, you\u2019ll always see the discount.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>This is because people behave differently and are worth different amounts of money, so you can pay a lot more money to acquire a full-price purchaser than you should to acquire a discount purchaser. Over the lifetime of the brand, they\u2019re far more likely to spend more money.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-optimizing-facebook-vs-your-supply-chain\">Optimising Facebook vs. your supply chain<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Spending a bunch of money on PR or even redesigning your <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/unboxing-experience\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">unboxing experience<\/a> is all part of paid acquisition. Facebook ads are not the only thing that we should count towards creating outcome.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>\u201cPart of my day is spent talking to clients who just want to improve their return-on-ad spend (ROAS). To create margin and net dollars in your pocket, look at your supply chain,\u201d Taylor said.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>He recommends <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/supply-chain-mapping\/\">mapping out<\/a> everywhere that you\u2019re spending dollars between when you order more product from your manufacturer and when it shows up at a <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/3pl\/\">3PL<\/a> like ShipBob, to what you\u2019re getting charged on a pick rate and what your charge is from your payment provider. It\u2019s a long chain with sometimes difficult-to-track down exact numbers.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-style-blog is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p><em>\u201cThere\u2019s generally so much more waste in a typical supply chain and people don\u2019t look at it with the same level of scrutiny that they do at the top of funnel, where it is so hard to significantly move those numbers. If I had to make an additional 10% improvement to your profit, it would probably be a safer bet to edit and <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/supply-chain-optimization\/\">optimise\u00a0your supply chain<\/a>.\u201d<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Taylor Holiday, Managing Partner of Common Thread Collective<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n\n\n<p>People tend to hyper focus on areas of nominal change, when there are other areas of massive waste happening.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\" id=\"h-conclusion\">Conclusion<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Data is fundamentally a story about the truth. If someone has a good brand, you can prove it. If you really want to understand if you\u2019re a brand of choice, take a look at your repeat purchases and study how customers interact with your over time.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Gathering historical data is invaluable. Partnering with a technology-driven 3PL can provide transparent and real-time fulfilment data and analytics tools to effectively plan ahead for future orders \u2014 and maybe even help you make connections between your marketing initiatives and what products are seeing repeat purchases.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>If you need an <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/ecommerce-fulfillment\/\">ecommerce fulfilment<\/a> partner that can help meet your customers\u2019 expectations around speedy shipping and keep them coming back for the delivery experience they want, check out <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/\">ShipBob<\/a>&nbsp;or <a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/quote\/\">request a quote here<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-button\"><a class=\"wp-block-button__link wp-element-button\" href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/quote\/\"><strong>Request a Fulfilment Quote<\/strong><\/a><\/div>\n\n\n\n<p>Read more from the series:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/dtc-brand-success-formula-web-smith\/\">The DTC Success Formula: Building a Brand [With Web Smith]<\/a><\/li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/vcs-invest-dtc-brands-kate-mcandrew\/\">What VCs Look for in DTC Brands When They Invest [With Kate McAndrew]<\/a><\/li>\n\n\n\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.shipbob.com\/blog\/social-proof-levers-dtc-brands-neel-grover\/\">The New Social Proof Levers for DTC Brands [With Neel Grover]<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Taylor Holiday discusses how LTV is all about the ability to measure your brand\u2019s existence. Learn how to get more customers to come back and buy again.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":110,"featured_media":23800,"parent":0,"template":"","meta":{"content-type":"","inline_featured_image":false,"footnotes":""},"blogcategories":[6],"class_list":["post-1163","blog","type-blog","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","blogcategories-ecommerce-tips"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO Premium plugin v27.5 (Yoast SEO v27.5) - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-premium-wordpress\/ -->\n<title>Brand is the Lifetime Value of Your Customer [With Taylor Holiday]<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Taylor Holiday discusses how LTV is all about the ability to measure your brand\u2019s existence. 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